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Post by Scott on Dec 28, 2014 11:25:22 GMT -5
Saw this last night. Overall, it moved better than the two previous Hobbit movies, no painfully slow sections.
One difference I’ve noticed between the LotR trilogy and the Hobbit trilogy is the landscape shots. With LotR they went out and found real locations that fit the story, and added to them. In the Hobbit, they use model landscapes, and they look like model landscapes.
There’s more super elf, and other cartoony type scenes, like the trolls with the catapults on their backs.
One of the more terrible elements of the film were the giant Dune-like were-worms that burrow through the mountains to make tunnels for the orcs. The orcs are apparently controlling them, but once the worms emerge from the ground, they just disappear. They don’t come out and join the battle; they don’t back up and crush the orcs that must be right behind them, they just disappear.
I can understand adding crap to the film to make it more awesome! But the point that really reinforced Jackson not getting Tolkien and the Hobbit is Thorin and the Arkenstone. When Bard rides to the gates of Erebor to parlay with the dwarves, he shows them the stone, and puts it back in his pocket. You never see the stone again. There’s no mention of what happens to it. The last we see of Thorin, his body is still lying where it fell.
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Post by GRWelsh on Dec 28, 2014 16:29:18 GMT -5
Disappointing but not surprising. Arguably, Peter Jackson's Tolkien movies have gotten progressively worse with each installment. "Fellowship of the Ring" was the best of them. At the time I had my nit-picks, but they were minor. Now I think if all of the Tolkien movies were at that same level of quality, I would be much happier.
I was watching some of the extras on the extended edition of "Desolation of Smaug" and there was this idyllic valley where they built the set for Beorn's house -- and for the some of the shots they actually put up green screens for the background. Imagine travelling to this remote pristine valley and end up acting in front of a green screen!
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Post by Scott on Dec 28, 2014 20:17:41 GMT -5
I agree, FotR was the best of his movies. The 5 Armies extended director's cut will be next, and that should be the end. Hollywood doesn't own the rights to anything else. I'd like to see a 1st age movie, but I don't think that will ever happen.
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Post by GRWelsh on Dec 29, 2014 11:55:35 GMT -5
Probably not soon, anyway. The Tolkien estate would have to sell those rights. But I wouldn't say never. There is a public appetite for Middle Earth now, and money to be made. I think with a different studio and/or director, it could be done, and even done well. I don't have a lot of hope -- but I do have some.
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Post by geneweigel on Dec 29, 2014 13:06:59 GMT -5
The books have forwarded into mainstream consciousness so much to a point its similar to the way the original 1968 M*A*S*H* novel was about extremely sensational inappropriate antics which were watered down for the film which in turn were watered down for television. In Tolkien's case its pretty obvious that the loss of the physicality/reality of being there is whats at hand in each progressing film. I haven't seen the recent film but the last HOBBIT installment the feeling was that of a play with shadows and light, even though the CGI sets were immense, I felt like I was watching a movie of people acting in front of a movie.
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Post by Scott on Dec 29, 2014 13:43:54 GMT -5
I guess I wouldn't say 'never', but certainly not until after Christopher Tolkien has entered the Halls of Mandos.
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Post by Scott on Dec 29, 2014 14:08:05 GMT -5
With the Desolation of Smaug, I had a general dislike for all of the Jackson-fluff, but there was a decent amount of material I liked. Five Armies is almost all Jackson-Fluff, plus some of the worst directorial decisions present in any of his Tolkien movies.
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 3, 2015 22:40:55 GMT -5
I just saw it. I think I agree with everything said so far.
In addition, the age of the actors is a big factor that is distracting. It seems like Ian McKellen and Christopher Lee can barely stand much less bring home a good performance.
Overall this is perfect for dumb bell type "player only" D&D people so I think it has to be appreciated as something other than any expectation that I ever had. For example, the air drop Beorn scene would have made me cry in its sheer underwhelmingness if I had not already had my expectations crushed by the whole Jackson run.
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Post by maximus on Jan 4, 2015 10:41:39 GMT -5
I guess it was fine for the kids; my 11 year old son loved it. For Tolkien purists it once again fell short. I was never a fan of Jackson's vision. This "series" could have easily been done as a 2 part film, rather than 3. It deviated from the story way too much, missing too many important points at the expense of adding meaningless garbage in; the Elf/Dwarf love story was the last straw...
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 4, 2015 10:47:21 GMT -5
Yeah, its kid-tastic for sure although these films may now influence future generations to disregard pre-Nebula Awards era classic fantasy altogether but that might be a good thing for us real sci-fi/fantasy readers.
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 5, 2015 10:41:42 GMT -5
I think CGI aside the real weirdness was the ultimate Scotch dwarf in Dain that was disconcerting. I thought he would be Scotch (Billy Connolly? Come on!) but he was off the Scot-o-meter with that version.
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Post by Scott on Jan 5, 2015 12:23:33 GMT -5
Oh yeah, I cringed when I heard the overly Scottish accent.
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Post by Scott on Jan 5, 2015 12:28:01 GMT -5
I like Billy Connolly, but I hate the Scottish dwarf shtick. Maybe he could be in a Braveheart remake?
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 5, 2015 13:05:32 GMT -5
Now that Tolkien's works have been sufficiently WARHAMMERed do think think there is the slightest chance of WARCRAFT THE MOVIE being more Tolkien than Tolkien?
HA! Fat chance of that!
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Post by Scott on Jan 5, 2015 14:19:22 GMT -5
Nah! But it wouldn't be so bad in a Warcraft movie.
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 5, 2015 16:39:32 GMT -5
I kind of ignored WORLD OF WARCRAFT (mmorpg 2004) after WARCRAFT 3 (rts 2002) sucked so badly but I kind of think that perhaps the film might have to be toned down and with that in mind maybe it'll be not half bad. Its not like they got Uwe Boll like the DUNGEON SIEGE (2007) and THE HOUSE OF THE DEAD (2003) videogames-to-movies did!  |
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Post by maximus on Jan 5, 2015 19:05:25 GMT -5
Oh yeah, I cringed when I heard the overly Scottish accent. They say, "if its not Scottish, its crap"... |
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Post by amalric on May 9, 2015 17:10:23 GMT -5
I like Billy Connolly, but I hate the Scottish dwarf shtick. Maybe he could be in a Braveheart remake? Welcome to my world.  When TSR printed IMAGINE magazine over here in the mid 1980s, the first comic strip at the back featured a dwarf named Auchter, who was of course Scottish. I think the act was old even back then, but having it revived for the LotR movies was poor - doesn't matter if the dour, moody dwarven stereotype fits the Scottish one, something different would have been nice. Problem is it messes with too many people's heads - can you imagine if the Elves spoke with Scottish accents, and the Dwarves as posh English gentlefolks? I'd enjoy it, but I guess I'm in the minority. |
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Post by geneweigel on May 9, 2015 21:23:04 GMT -5
I don't think that I would mind some dwarves sounding Scottish from certain areas if it wasn't just such a majority. It really kills the need for a presence of fantasy "men" who are Scot-like in game sessions.
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Post by GRWelsh on May 10, 2015 11:06:29 GMT -5
I don't really care for an "other the top" ethnic accent being tied to any particular demihuman race. If there was an appropriate accent for Tolkien's dwarves, I suppose Norse or something Scandinavian would be most appropriate. But I think no accent or a very slight accent would have been better. In these films, I thought Balin was the closest to how I envision Tolkien dwarves, both in the way he looked and talked.
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