Reshaping Greyhawk

[Scott]

I know I've mentioned this before.
This type of world shake up is probably the best way to continue the setting.
Decide what happens to Thrommel and Furyondy/Veluna, decide on the results of the wars brewing with Iuz/HS and with the GK. It creates a new landscape that could easily be disguised, and used to keep the torch burning in as close to form as possible.

[GT]

Well, most campaigns honestly end up "staking" Thrommel in the Temple (my group never finished; but they did figure out that the helpless vampire gig was a bit too easy, and didn't stake him...); but bein' a "happy ending" guy, I root for Thrommel and Jolene's reunion. An epic battle with Iuz and company could still claim a sizable portion of territory in Furyondy &/or Veluna and force the armies of good into retreat/exile--but ultimately, the game was originally geared for good to best evil, and that's how I reckon it oughta be! ^__^

[GT]

Oh, I forgot the Great Kingdom! If the status quo was maintained, Nyrond and the Iron League would come to blows with the Great Kingdom. But if the machinations of Zayene (Xaene) were exposed and thwarted, it might end up differently...

[Scott]

The Crook of Rao: Iggwilv and Iuz seem poised to strike, and this little geegaw seems to be a tide turner. What does it do? Apparently is dispels some lower planer creatures. In the looming confrontation. Would you make the acquisition of this item factor in to the outcome?

[GT]

I wish Gary had detailed Rao--I still have a letter wherein Gary states that Rao was probably the most powerful Greyhawk deity of Good--even over Pelor (but definitely not as powerful as Tharizdun)! There's food for thought! I granted the Crook some major Dispel/Banishment powers that certainly could turn the tide against any forces of evil that included creatures summoned from the Lower Planes... so, Yes, I would say the Crook would be a pivotal item for Good to possess or Evil to keep out of the hands of Weal! ^__^

[geneweigel]

Did I ever tell you about this e-mail about "Rao" from 2002? I had queried Gary about Rao's Superman roots and he dodged a lot but dropped this little nugget:

Never detailed the planet's names, but I always assumed 10 in the Oerth's system, one out beyond Pluto.

He seemed to frown upon my conjectured "Hextor" as Mars so there must have been a quieter unknown deity for that one.

[ghul]

Interesting posts, GT and Gene. I never imagined Rao as the most potent of the good-aligned bunch.

[geneweigel]

He's analagous to planet Jupiter.

You know I was just thinking. Do you remember the city mentioned in SEA OF DEATH in an Eclavdra "mental musing"? Here:

Chapter 5
THE DEEP DARKNESS of Graz'zt's own layer of the Abyss pleased Eclavdra. The blackness reminded her of her own homeland deep beneath the surface of Oerth. The mockery of a tropical paradise where demon inflicted pain and suffering befell helpless and unsuspecting creatures satisfied and pleased her senses. The worst of the drow city of Urlisindatu, a sink of debauchery and base cruelty, could not compare for a moment to this wonderful place ruled by the demon king.

Do you think its the same?

Shit, Trowbane wasn't the same...

Anyway, heres a great paragraph from that same chapter:

Eclavdra's high hopes had sunk a bit at the mention of Vuron. The Lord Steward was an androgynous albino, as white as Graz'zt was black. Of all the demons who associated or allied with the six-fingered demon lord, Vuron was possibly the most evil and intelligent. Surprisingly, the dark elf had found him — it? — unswervingly loyal and devoted to Graz'zt. This made her both uneasy and very suspicious of the competition. Eclavdra had aspired to a private conference with her master. Vuron's participation was a cold and unwelcome douche to her anticipated opportunity.

Did Gary kiss his mother with that mouth?

[Scott]

What’s brewing in the spring of 579.
A party of adventurers is riding into Hommlet.
Iuz’s navy has been destroyed.
His northern army has been soundly defeated and scattered, but it seems like there is no immanent threat there. But the Nomads and Rovers are getting uppity.
Iuz has captured the west shore of Whyestil Lake and all but the southwest corner of the Vesve Forest.
Furyondy suffered a defeat in a counter attack in which they hoped to push the invading Iuzites back, but they still dominate the waters of Whyestil Lake.
The conflict is expected to continue.
There is conflict between the Horned Society and the Bandit Kingdoms.
Conflict seems likely to erupt between the Tenh and the Pale

There is conflict on all sides of the Great Kingdom, and Nyrond and allies have just declared war.

The setting is ripe for reshaping.

What wild cards are there?
The Shield Lands: what part do they play in all this? Support for Furyondy? Offensive action against there closest threats, the Horned Society and the Bandit Kingdoms, which are engaged in conflict with each other?
The ToEE/Thrommel: A party really could sway the fate of kingdoms. If the Temple is allowed to strengthen, Iuz, as the sole commander, would certainly use its forces as expendable at this juncture to draw forces away from him. Thrommel’s release would be a crushing blow to Iuz.
In the near future you have the return of Iggwilv and the Crook of Rao to consider, but not yet.
If you place Isle of the Ape several years in the future, we can guess that Iggwilv has been freed, but no serious conflict has erupted yet. Perhaps the return of Iggwilv gave Iuz reason to delay, but we still have no clue to Thrommel’s fate. If we use the notes picked up from Gary’s game we could assume that he was never freed and the ToEE is out of the picture by year’s end. In that case, the Crook would play a big role. Failure to retrieve it should result in big gains for Iuz/Iggwilv, just the opposite if the party succeeds.

[Scott]

Starting a campaign along the southern Vesve in the spring of 579 CY really sounds like something with a lot of potential.

[Scott]

And don't forget about the Circle of Eight. The Yatil Mountains location of the Citadel was contrived for the novels I believe. Gary suggested that the actual location was the hilly northwest region of the Vesve, and when chatting about the war he had envisioned, both Mordenkainen and Robilar would have gotten involved. Perhaps Robilar would have ended up with a new freehold in the Fellreev or the Bandit Kingdoms.

[GT]

I'd heard the Citadel was in the Clatspurs, just off of the Yatils... ^__^

[GT]

If you add the EEG to the GDQ series or T1-4 and it's released, there's a possibility of a massive rise in Evil from that quadrant (especially if it summons its two kindred!) That could make things interesting... Also, I kept the Slave Lords intact as an organization, and have my own evil group (the Watchers) that can supply intrigue and havoc as needed.

[GT]

Robilar, Otto and Quij would certainly form the core of another "force to be reckoned with". Given a stronghold, effective allies and enough capital, Robilar could become a force in several locations--the Wild Coast, for example.

[geneweigel]

How about the rise of Stoink? They were going "there" anyway maybe it could take over the Eastern Free Lords?

Perhaps have the Iron League and the Golden League unite to reclaim Rauxes while the North Province, Rel Astra, the Sea Barons and Medegia cut it loose to grow in power separately and autonomously.

Perhaps have one of the Iron League states go sour as well. That would definitely be interesting.

Keoland was always on the verge of something perhaps the mage of the valley has been softening the real valley up for himself...

[Scott]

Boss Dhaelhy of Stoink, as of the Spring of 579, has commited troops to the west to help repel the HS invasion. Things really don't look good for the Bandit Kingdoms.
The Iron League also looked like it was in trouble, but Nyrond/Almor declaring war on the Great Kingdom may save them. The whole east looks like it's about to explode.
Action in the west and southwest was never detailed, so that's all up for grabs. Ket seems like a candidate to stir things up there. Who knows what could ride in from the west.

[ghul]

In my own version of Stoink, it is a lot more like Lankhmar than GH City is. You know, as Ronnie James said: You're all fools, the mob rules!

[Scott]

My campaign's never gone to Stoink, so it's just what is there from the Gord yarns, and Dragon.

[GRWelsh]

Every time I hear "The Mob Rules" I still think of the HEAVY METAL movie, with the scene of the horde of corrupted green humans overrunning the city with spear-guns and flame-throwers...

[GT]

"DEATH!! Death to all who oppose us!!!! " ^__^