City based modules.

[Axe Mental]

Is there a city based module that could be placed in the city of Greyhawk?

[foster1941]

I had a series of modules published in the 2E era (and set in the 2E version of Greyhawk City) that I spent an absurd amount of time trying to convert to something decent (my stack of conversion notes was almost as thick as the module itself -- including a page by page parsing of the Gord novels gleaning details about the 'real' city from them), but the effort was in vain and for all my efforts those modules (I no longer remember the codes or exact names but they were the "Falcon" trilogy -- I only ever had the first two) still sucked. This wasted effort was in large part what finally put me off 'official' D&D for good -- realizing that if I had to do so much conversion effort that I was essentially re-writing the module from the ground up, what was I actually paying for? So obviously I can't recommend those...

[Axe Mental]

I too have spent countless hours trying to convert bad material into something playable. Usually that means ignoring any kind of plot and going straight to the dungeon, usually adding my own monster encounters here and there. With a city I suppose that would be very hard. It seems the main problem with doing a city based module is the fact that 1. in a city everyone would be on it (esp. the city guard) and 2. the DM needing a developed city to work from. I suppose the first could be solved by making the city government corrupt and perhaps turning a blind eye to it (perhaps an evil magician's dungeon were he experiments on the poor of the city, and serves on an unofficial basis to the majistrate); and problem 2 could be solved with some type of random generation of buildings and occupants (created as you go). Has such a generator been created already (if so is it old school in flavor). Ex. might be role a d100.

[guest]

i realize that no one has written on this topic for a while, but i would like to respond to it anyway.

i think that good city modules would counter these problems straight on. first of all, inorder to really have a 'developed' city, all the module requires is a detailed neighborhood-sized area within an urban setting. the 'hood could be detailed such that its own traditions and culture must not coincide with those of the rest of the city. think of the bronx, for example, as a microcosm of a neighborhood set within a larger city.
secondly, the city guard and other adventurers do not all have to be involved, but they certainly can be! in the module "the grey citadel" (d20, i know), the adventure places RIVAL adventure parties seeking the same goal. in a similar sense, the guards can be put to work doing mop-up duty in the background, while PCs do the real work. alternatively, a major diversion could be in place; while the guards respond to some external threat, the PCs deal with the real villain in his villa or tower, etc.
because city adventures occur in close proximity to abundant resources (manpower, food, healing, magic, etc), an urban adventure can really be made a little more difficult than what PCs of comparable level would normally face in a wilderness or dungeon setting.

dellenthor

[Scott]

As a DM, I like the idea of city-based adventures. Unfortunately, I have yet to find players who enjoy city setting. They ignore every adventure hook I cast, and the city remains a place to rest, heal, identify, and replace/add party members.

[geneweigel]

guest said:

think of the bronx, for example, as a microcosm of a neighborhood set within a larger city.

All the Boroughs of New York are like counties elsewhere.

Each having their own particular neighborhoods and subneighborhoods but are more like separate towns.

For example, I now live in New York City in the Borough of Queens but on my mail its listed by neighborhood as "Middle Village NY" and Queens is listed on forms as "county". However, I mentioned subneighborhoods. Where I grew up was in New York City in the Borough of Brooklyn and mail there comes as "Brooklyn, NY" and the county of Brooklyn is listed on forms as "Kings". However, the "town" in the county is the virtual "neighborhood" and the actual neighborhood is within the virtual "neighborhood" as a kind of subneighborhood. Mine for example was Cypress Hills within the neighborhood of East New York. They were very distinct ive from each other with their own aldermen. Police precincts cover 3 or 4 "neighborhoods" BTW.

There also exists block by block "associations" with crude governments that can arrange "block parties". However, during the fall of many neighborhoods to crime and "affordable housing" they broke down over time.

If you peruse London's medieval past you'll find a very elaborate system along the lines that I mention above for modern New York.

[geneweigel]

BTW I live in an unnamed subneighborhood but it seems to be "Irish Middle Village On The Other Side Of The Cemetary Near Maspeth and Ridgewood" from the average description and if you threw it out in Arizona it'd probably be considered its own town.

[dcas]

If you peruse London's medieval past you'll find a very elaborate system along the lines that I mention above for modern New York.

And London proper is only what? about one square mile in the center? I remember reading that if the King wanted to enter London proper he would first have to stop at an inn on the outskirts to ask the permission of the Lord Mayor.

Modern-day neighborhoods are probably about the same size as mediaeval cities or large mediaeval towns. My own neighborhood, Port Richmond in Philadelphia, has a population of around 24,000 people. That's slightly larger than Yggsburgh (pop 22,000) but smaller than Greyhawk (pop 53,000). So it might not be a bad idea to start with your own neighborhood and build it up from there. For example, base your city map on a street map of your neighborhood. This works especially well if your neighborhood predates the automobile and the trolley (mine predates both, though some streets were built after the latter was introduced and some were widened for the former).

[geneweigel]

The term "borough" originally meant a walled household or group of households and over time it grew into a greater and greater political area at one time run by "bailiffs".

[axeguest]

It would be kinda cool to make a 1E New York, in that its a cool setting geographically w/Manhattan island and all, and climate wise its good too. Not sure what you'd call it.

[Scott]

The Great Kingdom is what it was called in EGG's home Greyhawk campaign.

[axeguest]

Was it published? Man, what I'd give for all his original notes and drawings.