|
Post by geneweigel on Nov 15, 2007 11:25:33 GMT -5
I just ordered it. Although, I have been burning the midnight oil lately working like a dog on illustrations, I might not have the time to review it in a serious way. But I'll try (when it gets here anyway). Speaking of illustrations, I've got to break out the paint! Gene looks around his disheveled home...Mebbe not today...
|
|
|
Post by geneweigel on Nov 15, 2007 11:33:38 GMT -5
They said it'll ship in 1-2 business days so maybe by the end of next week...ARGH! I don't think anyone will be home next week. Shit!
|
|
|
Post by Scott on Nov 15, 2007 11:42:15 GMT -5
I waited a long time because they were waiting to get the signed copies back from Gary. I didn't know I ordered the autographed version. Now if only I could get my order from Rob.
|
|
|
Post by geneweigel on Nov 15, 2007 12:37:05 GMT -5
I forgot to order that. I'll wait til he's back in shape.
|
|
|
Post by grodog on Nov 15, 2007 21:18:00 GMT -5
BC's done, so if you want place an order, now's the time to do it I had a chance to check out tacojohn's copy of the East Mark Folio/Gaz. last night. It looks pretty good, but I'm still not sold on buying it vs. the version that'll be in the box set. I may borrow it after our game on Saturday to check it out in more earnest (perhaps it'll get me to read Yggsburgh finally, too....).
|
|
|
Post by Scott on Nov 16, 2007 10:45:21 GMT -5
Once I get the other adventure I ordered months ago, and I start seeing posts saying, "I got it" from the people that pre-ordered BC, I'll place an order. The Gaz is kind of useless if you already have the Yggsburgh book, but the adventure alone makes the purchase worth it. I might think differently if a release date was set for the Upper Ruins set, but who knows how long that will be. The material is very old school Gygax in feel. Seeing a gate to Barsoom, seeing encounters with militant kobolds, seeing mention of the jeweled man on the rumors table, the elves and dwarves that had lairs in the castle, the ogre, etc. in print in a Gygax product definately make the product worth it for me, even if I'll get the same material (hopefully) in a later product.
|
|
ghul
Enchanter
Posts: 272
|
Post by ghul on Nov 16, 2007 22:30:28 GMT -5
Glad you are enjoying it so far, Scott. As far as a release date for Upper Works, all I can say is that Gary and I are working every day, handling the drafting, revising, and fine-tuning of 5 mss. at once for this boxed set. All is going well. Once we hammer through every ms. and turn them in to the Trolls for the next phase, I'm sure Steve will announce a release date. Nothing can stop us now. --Jeff T. PS: looking forward to BC as well, prepaid for it when PPP first solicited it earlier in the year. I have no doubt that it will be nothing short of incredible; in fact, I don't recall one adventure by RJK that I haven't absolutely loved.
|
|
|
Post by grodog on Nov 16, 2007 22:58:03 GMT -5
What are you missing, orders-wise from Rob, Scott? He should be catching up on all back orders as he's shipping out BC.
Sounds like I'll have to borrow the East Mark Gaz, at least, now....
|
|
|
Post by geneweigel on Nov 18, 2007 12:25:54 GMT -5
Well, I recieved it yesterday and its a very nice layout.
|
|
|
Post by Scott on Nov 18, 2007 12:35:57 GMT -5
Yes. Probably the best I've seen from the Trolls.
|
|
ghul
Enchanter
Posts: 272
|
Post by ghul on Nov 18, 2007 12:47:58 GMT -5
Peter B did the layout. I think layout is important, because in the end, we DMs need to use these books. Function is more important than style in this regard. For example, when the 3e books came out, and my group started playing, it was hard to see what the pages said in my dark, stinky cellar with single light bulb suspended above. I've also bought products with fancy script that is supposed to evoke a sense of "ancientness" or something, but in the end, give me century gothic, times new, courier new, or arial on white paper, please, because I need to read this shit.
Cheers, --Jeff T.
|
|
|
Post by Scott on Nov 18, 2007 13:36:47 GMT -5
Did Peter do Dark Chateau too? That one was awful. It was a terrible case of style over function.
|
|
ghul
Enchanter
Posts: 272
|
Post by ghul on Nov 18, 2007 13:38:57 GMT -5
Dunno.
|
|
|
Post by geneweigel on Nov 18, 2007 14:55:14 GMT -5
Wow, am I hungover...
Now let's rip this shit out and glue my aching eyes on it...
The content is just as good as anything from the heyday of TSR and the approach seems like a true Gygaxian environs as opposed to the "lighter brush" that he's been using in recent fare with other co-writers.
That said, the content of the generic art is still distracting. I would prefer something DCSIII-ish for this. That is small, inked and no frills quasi-medieval. I hate busting on Mr B over and over again but nevertheless the "goblin ambuscade full pager" would feel wrong even if it was by one of the greats of TSR. If I recall correctly there was a picture in DARK CHATEAU with this same woman warrior being beset by goblins and the full page seemed inappropriate as well. I'd suggest these pics be made smaller and save the full pager for a huge "content illustration" only. Like a gate or any specific feature. Having these full blown raise too many questions. A singular woman warrior being attacked by goblins? Where's her D&D comrades? Anyway the illustrated pictures of "the gate", the "castle" and "the cave" are getting there but the generic "doe-eyed wench surprised at a humanoid patron" is derailing and anathema. I think more control needs to put into the content and specific illustration should be all important especially in this series.
As for gazetteers, honestly, I fucking hate them with a passion. I know the old 80 folio and WOG box had them but I'll be damned if I'm not sick of the sight of them these days. I've read so many fantasy gazetteers that I now deem them all worthless. That said, this one does seem well put together and is filled with applicable content.
So the adventure is quite the way I'd imagine it being laid out. As an appetizing preview of things to come, I'd say we've got a lot to look forward to. All we have to do is squint our eyes and imagine Sutherland/Tramp art interspersing it.
|
|
ghul
Enchanter
Posts: 272
|
Post by ghul on Nov 18, 2007 16:46:56 GMT -5
Wow, am I hungover... Now let's rip this shit out and glue my aching eyes on it... The content is just as good as anything from the heyday of TSR and the approach seems like a true Gygaxian environs as opposed to the "lighter brush" that he's been using in recent fare with other co-writers. <snip> So the adventure is quite the way I'd imagine it being laid out. As an appetizing preview of things to come, I'd say we've got a lot to look forward to. All we have to do is squint our eyes and imagine Sutherland/Tramp art interspersing it. Hi Gene, I've snipped the art comments as I have little to do with how Peter handles his part of the job, except that some illustrations were my requests, like the ogre (which I think is fantastic!) and the goblin statue, and a few others. But I will thank you for the kind words in regards to the content. I followed the method I've heard Frank Mentzer cite on many occasions, in which he talks about studying "High Gygaxian" as he worked on Temple of Elemental Evil. In the past few years, starting from when I lined up my first Yggsburgh city expansion gig, I began really studying Gary's style -- not just the words, but the pacing as well. I'm still doing this today, studying his classic modules, and re-reading the Gord yarns as well (for added inspiration). My sincere wish is that my contributions to Castle Zagyg are nigh invisible -- or at don't stick out like a sore thumb. It's gratifying for me when Gary offers me praise during development, and now even moreso as some of the old grognards such as yourselves appear approve of the work so far. That being said, I fail to be complacent in my own efforts and constantly strive to improve. I am learning on the job, as they say, but if I am an apprentice it is to the greatest master in this trade, and that I do not take lightly. Thanks again. Regards, Jeff T.
|
|
|
Post by GRWelsh on Nov 18, 2007 17:40:20 GMT -5
Scott, any chance you'll run "Mouths of Madness" for us? Or is this something you'd rather save for when the Upper Works comes out?
Gene, can you post some of your illustrations? Maybe you ought to self-publish.
I haven't looked over the new product yet, but I also prefer art that is more functional and less about style. I like armor that looks like real armor, and weapons that look like they could actually be lifted and do damage. And I like monster illustrations to look like the monster descriptions... that's probably why I'm such a big fan of the new Otherworld miniatures, with their pig-faced orcs, Trampier-looking giants, etc. I'd love to see an illustration booklet such as what was in S1, for the Upper Works... And wouldn't it be cool to bring in Erol Otus, Bill Willingham, Jeff Dee, Jim Roslof and possibly a few other veterans from "those days" to each do a piece for the Castle Zagyg releases?
|
|
|
Post by geneweigel on Nov 18, 2007 17:41:11 GMT -5
In regards, to the "ogre" I didn't even know what you were referring to! Its that "tavern-looking picture". Weird that it didn't connect to the text right there for me. So thats a kid with an ogre-sized flagon? No wonder that I didn't connect it, it doesn't make sense. Another thing that offsets my thinking is that I think that his goblins are enragingly not to my taste and I totally hate the devil goblin statue, I'd prefer something more imaginative than what appears to be a "goblin with devil template thing". I would expect a stocky and stout image with bulging eyes, a fat tongue sticking out perhaps. Not some lithe, airy being of tenderness and love which is what is depicted within as a statue of a devil goblin. It throws me off. I don't "get" that. Art really irks the shit out of me as you can guess.
|
|
|
Post by geneweigel on Nov 18, 2007 17:54:10 GMT -5
Scott, any chance you'll run "Mouths of Madness" for us? Or is this something you'd rather save for when the Upper Works comes out? Gene, can you post some of your illustrations? Maybe you ought to self-publish. Yes, self-publishing is definitely my only route. The wait for feedback is annoying and throws me off. Well, this may be an exceptional case but I hate being ignored and ignored especially in regards to creative things. In regards to getting paid, well, honestly? I don't think it was going to happen anyway so why not go the "free road" then if everybody likes it I'll charge them for the next project. It actually may be sooner than you think because I just organized every idea that I've ever had which comes to 20 adventures, a couple of games, countless miscellaneous ideas. That would be great if I could put out an adventure before the LG Con then run it there. I've had several requests to see what I've illustrated so far but I'm going to have to decline that way I'll have more motivation to get this done. Perhaps, I'll have a preview when I'm in the final stages.
|
|
|
Post by Scott on Nov 18, 2007 21:26:14 GMT -5
I have to see what I can for a day with my new schedule and Liana's new schedule. The holidays coming makes things tough too.
|
|
|
Post by Scott on Nov 19, 2007 10:20:45 GMT -5
I'm kind of disappointed no thouls are listed on the random encounter charts.
|
|