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Post by GRWelsh on Jan 13, 2021 12:56:38 GMT -5
This show premieres this week on Disney+ and I'm looking forward to it. The trailers are so weird and quirky... I am liking the whole vibe of sitcoms throughout history with nods to shows like Bewitched. Seems like a fresh approach to blend a few genres together when the plot will probably revolve around Scarlet Witch's power to warp reality. When I was young, the Vision was one of my favorite characters. Whoever wrote him in the Avengers in the mid-70's really seemed to like him as well, as he was always given a lot of emphasis and portrayed as powerful. He took on the Squadron Supreme, the Marvel equivalent of Superman, Green Arrow and Black Canary! In later years, he always seemed to malfunction, get destroyed, or was just was played down in some way. https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/53eyyc/respect_the_vision_marvel_616/I was thinking about an old storyline with the Vision being given the brain patterns of Simon Williams (Wonder Man), and wondering if that may come up in the new WandaVision show. One of the first issues of the Avengers I ever bought had the Vision fighting Wonder Man in a sort of love triangle with the Scarlet Witch -- Iron Man cut it short, and later in the same issue they fought Graviton and all lost. Thor had to come in and bail them out in the next issue.
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 14, 2021 8:35:16 GMT -5
Remember when he was supposed to be a mental clone of Wonder Man?
I think that the Scarlet Witch's timeline was muddled as well. I think they got too "Star Warsy" with the "I am your father" for her. The whole Pietro/Wanda escape to the Avengers just to have her dragged back when Magneto turned nice in the 80's.
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Post by GRWelsh on Jan 14, 2021 8:48:55 GMT -5
A lot of those stories were kind of messy. The Vision had Wonder Man's brain patterns, then lost them. Wonder Man died, then was brought back as a zombie by the Black Talon. Wanda took up with Simon for a while, before the Vision got his personality back, somehow. The Vision and Wanda had kids which were revealed to be demons, or something like that... It was all so weird and convoluted. They went back and forth over whether Magneto was the father of Quicksilver and the Scarlet Witch. I think at first their father was the Whizzer from the Golden Age, then later revealed to be Magneto, then still later revealed to not be Magneto. There was something about Wundagore Mountain and an anthropomorphic cow named Bova, but I forget the details.
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 14, 2021 10:25:06 GMT -5
It was weird that fellow fans knew all these "obscure" characters so well in the early 80s. Maybe it was that the characters became less approachable due to accumulation of twists. I guess they write it off as modernization but it's just too much story after a while.
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Post by GRWelsh on Jan 15, 2021 18:38:09 GMT -5
I watched the first two episodes of WandaVision. It is definitely quirky and fresh, with a layer of mystery building under the nostalgic sitcom vibe. I'm liking where this is going so far. It's not so much superheroes but like a "Twilight Zone" genre.
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 17, 2021 12:46:42 GMT -5
I hope it is better than the two VISION SCARLET WITCH mini-series of the 80's.. ((Cringe)))
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Post by GRWelsh on Jan 18, 2021 14:44:11 GMT -5
I never read those but I know that is where their children come from. I'm not worried. So far, Marvel Studios has done a good job of pulling stuff from their lore but in an interesting way. An excellent miniseries that I did read was THE VISION (2015-2016) written by Tom King. That was the one where the Vision created a family of synthezoids (wife, daughter and son) and tried to live a normal life in the suburbs. It may have inspired this TV series for the basic idea that everything seems fine but there is trouble under the surface.
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Post by GRWelsh on Jan 21, 2021 13:37:14 GMT -5
I'm trying to guess how this series is going to end. I can't imagine that the Vision will still be alive. My guess is that after being heartbroken about Vision's death, Wanda lost her grip on reality and is using her powers to warp reality around her but that it is presenting a danger and others are trying to "get in" to contact her and convince her to "come back to reality" -- she will remember what happened and be heartbroken again but the Vision will be dead. Another guess is that she is being manipulated by a super villain with emotion control or illusion power causing her to use her powers to warp reality. In any case, I think her actions will spawn an alternate universe, or tie into being able to visit alternate realities within the multiverse.
I feel like I'm missing something obvious, like a super villain who is a perfect fit to explain what is going on.
A lot of people are saying "Agnes" is Agatha Harkness, and if so, Mephisto seems like a candidate to be the main villain.
Red is the first color we see after being in a black and white world for a while.
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GT
Wizard
Duke of Indiana, Knight Commander
Posts: 2,032
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Post by GT on Jan 22, 2021 17:39:58 GMT -5
Interestingly; Red Tornado (the android, not Ma Hunkel from the Justice Society) and Vision both came out about the same time: August, 1968 and October, 1968 respectively.
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Post by GRWelsh on Jan 22, 2021 18:23:13 GMT -5
Yes, it is one of the unsolved mysteries of comics -- was one stolen from the other, or was it just a coincidence they came out at the same time? This article leans towards the coincidental explanation, but I've always found them to be too similar to believe that... So maybe it wasn't a rip off but cross-pollination of ideas between artists and writers who talked across the lines. One thing is for sure: the Vision is more cosmetically similar to his Golden Age namesake than Red Tornado is to his. comiccoverage.typepad.com/comic_coverage/2007/08/which-came-firs.html#:~:text=Evil%20scientist%20T.O.Morrow%20created,sent%20to%20kill%20the%20Avengers. I watched the third episode of WandaVision and much is revealed and I have a better theory. Without spoilers, I'll just say what I am enjoying the most are the details like opening visuals and theme songs true to their decade, the non-funny sitcom jokes followed up by laugh tracks, and the fake commercials with Marvel easter eggs. At first I thought this show's premise was silly but now I love it.
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Post by GRWelsh on Jan 25, 2021 8:31:06 GMT -5
WandaVision is keeping me subscribed to Disney+ along with THE FALCON AND THE WINTER SOLDIER and upcoming STAR WARS TV Shows... There are a bunch of them: OBI-WAN KENOBI, AHSOKA, THE BOOK OF BOBA FETT, RANGERS OF THE NEW REPUBLIC, ANDOR, THE ACOLYTE, LANDO and some animated shows. Is it too much? Maybe, but that means more chances to get something good.
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 25, 2021 9:38:02 GMT -5
Watched 2 episodes and there was a bit of confusion as to what dad is making us watch which I was grasping at straws. The Watcher? Time Variance Authority? Witches?
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Post by GRWelsh on Jan 25, 2021 13:07:24 GMT -5
I agree it is weird, but being confused by WandaVision is what made it so fresh and interesting. "What genre of entertainment am I even watching?" Hang in there until the end of the third episode, which is when you begin to get answers.
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 25, 2021 13:58:50 GMT -5
That sounds good. Even the SW stuff sounds interesting.
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Post by GRWelsh on Jan 30, 2021 7:43:31 GMT -5
Episode 4 gives even more answers. Marvel Studios likes to draw upon old comic book stories but does it to make something new, which keeps me guessing. Otherwise I'd say it is obvious Agnes is Agatha Harkness and the main villain is Mephisto or Master Pandemonium, and that the series will end with Doctor Strange intervening or being released from some sort of imprisonment.
Lots of references to past movies, and lots of details. I'm actually glad they didn't release it all at once, because I missed the old experience of speculating week to week, and now I'm getting to have that again.
Edit: I think I just figured it out based on two clues, but I'll shut up now.
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Post by geneweigel on Feb 27, 2021 15:35:46 GMT -5
Well it certainly is going there. It seemed unlikely but did you see the after credits scene in last night's episode? Are they going to mention the original Human Torch at this point? He was shown in Captain America briefly.
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Post by GRWelsh on Feb 28, 2021 7:12:11 GMT -5
I did see the after credits scene. I doubt they will mention the original Human Torch at this point as there is only one more episode and that might be too convoluted and obscure to get into. But I thought the same thing when I saw the Vision's dismantled body and I would not have been surprised if one of the S.W.O.R.D. scientists made a reference to Phineas Horton's creation. There are so many easter eggs in the props that it might be there and I missed it. This show draws heavily upon the 1980's comic books and the original Human Torch did make a reappearance then in the West Coast Avengers, so who knows? As I recall, Byrne altered the backstory by saying Ultron made the Vision from the spare parts of the original Human Torch which explained their similarity yet allowed for both characters to exist at the same time.
BTW, the acting on the last episode was excellent. Elizabeth Olsen deserves some kind of award. I could feel the grief and the mental breakdown happening. And Kathryn Hahn has been consistently great. Best Marvel TV show yet.
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Post by geneweigel on Mar 12, 2021 10:51:38 GMT -5
I honestly don't know how to talk about this show without giving away the surprises.
I still think that the Human Torch is going to be approached under the Submariner, Bucky and the Vision. Where they are going to think that the Vision was based on parts of him but then find out that he is separate. They built the entire "Human Torch air chamber" and detailed robot for CAPTAIN AMERICA: THE FIRST AVENGER (2011) so there has to be a pretty good chance.
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Post by GRWelsh on Mar 12, 2021 11:30:21 GMT -5
I still think that the Human Torch is going to be approached under the Submariner, Bucky and the Vision. Where they are going to think that the Vision was based on parts of him but then find out that he is separate. They built the entire "Human Torch air chamber" and detailed robot for CAPTAIN AMERICA: THE FIRST AVENGER (2011) so there has to be a pretty good chance. That would be awesome and the more I think about it... Yes, it is possible. Marvel Studios has been quite amazing the way they pull in obscure details and characters. This could set this up on THE FALCON AND THE WINTER SOLDIER with a flash back to WW2 showing the Invaders fighting the Nazis. It is interesting how WW2 is the one immutable time stamp in Marvel continuity. When Cap was first thawed out in the comics, it was in Avengers #4 in March 1964 and less than 20 years since the end end of WW2... In the MCU, he was frozen for 70 years... In some future iteration he may be into Buck Rogers territory!
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Post by grodog on Mar 22, 2021 22:14:19 GMT -5
We watched WandaVision ep4 over the weekend, will keep going I suppose.
Allan.
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