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Post by Scott on Aug 7, 2011 12:14:48 GMT -5
Have you ever noticed the outdoor movement rate seems brutally slow. Each square equals 100 yards. One square/hour searching, three squares/hour walking. It would take you two days to walk the two and a half miles to the Caves.
The distance from the Keep to the Caves is fits with Gary's standard: Greyhawk city to the Castle, Hommlet to the Moathouse, the sample dungeon in the DMG, but the PCs here would be trudging through the wilderness for days just getting back and forth to the Caves.
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Post by GRWelsh on Aug 7, 2011 16:12:48 GMT -5
Not sure what EGG was thinking, but that was most likely an error. Even for off-road travel, that is really slow. 1 mile is just over 17 squares on that B2 Wilderness map. According to the DMG, p. 58, even with a heavy burden in very rugged terrain, you can go 2 miles per day. Using the B2 Wilderness movement rate, it would take you over 11 hours to walk 2 miles.
Perhaps EGG was working with a different scale earlier, and then changed it but forgot to change the movement rate.
I've always just ignored the B2 move rates.
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Post by Scott on Aug 7, 2011 17:58:19 GMT -5
I'm guessing that he was trying to encourage some more wilderness exploration, which I can appreciate, but the distance is way out of whack.
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Post by Scott on Aug 8, 2011 7:19:19 GMT -5
I think the next time I run this, I will keep the movement rate and increase the size of each square.
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Post by GRWelsh on Sept 5, 2012 11:11:08 GMT -5
The problem with increasing the area of each square is the same as having Yggsburgh too far from Castle Zagyg -- if the places to explore are too far away, that forces more random wilderness encounters and overnight camping in the dungeon and/or wilderness on novice level characters. I.e., nearly certain death.
I don't think the Caves of Chaos should be far away, but I do think players should have to search for them. One thing I've never done enough of when DMing this module was to make the players search for the Caves. I've usually had them go from the KEEP directly to the entrance to the ravine, to move things along. But, if all the players know is that the Caves are "within a few miles of the KEEP, somewhat east," then they will be searching in the right general direction, and have to make use of the wilderness map. And that friendly magpie can squawk at them if they go too far...
"Ca-CAW, Ca-CAW, too far, Ca-CAW!"
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Post by Scott on Sept 5, 2012 11:27:17 GMT -5
After getting more experience with Yggsburgh, I'd reconsider my earlier statement. I think the stories you hear from the earliest Greyhawk sessions, the dungeons were 2 - 3 miles from 'base' is ideal for the newbie PCs.
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Post by geneweigel on Sept 5, 2012 16:01:51 GMT -5
Its for off road thats why it seems so slow.
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Post by geneweigel on Sept 6, 2012 8:08:44 GMT -5
I was going to post this yesterday but PHOTOBUCKET kept saying my account was under maintenance:  [[ ]]
When colorized the forest and fen actually don't seem so all encompassing.
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foster1941
Warlock
Duke of California, Earl of Los Angeles, Knight Bachelor
Posts: 475
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Post by foster1941 on Feb 2, 2016 18:24:16 GMT -5
If you turn the outdoor movement rates "per hour" into "per turn" they look a lot more reasonable, and the Caves become a couple hours' ride from the Keep once their location is known. That makes so much more sense that I strongly suspect it's what was intended all along and the "per hour" thing was an editorial error.
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Post by Scott on Feb 2, 2016 19:18:28 GMT -5
Knowing Gary's de facto town to dungeon placement, that sounds right.
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