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Post by geneweigel on Jan 18, 2008 11:48:20 GMT -5
BTW, Bill is still reeling over meeting Gary while we were all enjoying a cigarette, shaking hands and then me telling Gary how Bill has an unhealthy obsession with KEEP ON THE BORDERLANDS to which Gary started talking about B2 minutiae while designing the goblin caves. Bill's head looked like it was going to explode.
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Post by grodog on Jan 18, 2008 15:39:55 GMT -5
LOL. Very mysterious. Say hi to Bill, when you chat next. Will he rejoin you at the show in June?
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 18, 2008 15:52:36 GMT -5
And he was never heard from again...
Actually, I have no idea. He's a newly married man now so things like going away for a weekend in the summertime may not fly.
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Rhuvein
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Beware . . Mjolnir
Posts: 228
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Post by Rhuvein on Jan 18, 2008 23:26:31 GMT -5
And he was never heard from again... Actually, I have no idea. He's a newly married man now so things like going away for a weekend in the summertime may not fly. That is pretty mysterious. And I had thought that you guys were close and stayed in touch. On the other hand, I do know what happens to some guys when they meet a women and are smitten . . . ;D Hopefully it's all good, I wish the best for Bill. Seemed to be a real nice guy.
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Rhuvein
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Beware . . Mjolnir
Posts: 228
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Post by Rhuvein on Jan 18, 2008 23:28:13 GMT -5
the box for Gygaxian Fantasy Worlds. Yes, you're welcome. I was glad to snag it and give it to you!! ;)
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Rhuvein
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Beware . . Mjolnir
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Post by Rhuvein on Jan 18, 2008 23:30:14 GMT -5
Hey, congrats, Grodog. Ditto!! Well done!
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Rhuvein
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Beware . . Mjolnir
Posts: 228
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Post by Rhuvein on Jan 18, 2008 23:37:56 GMT -5
BTW, Bill is still reeling over meeting Gary while we were all enjoying a cigarette, shaking hands and then me telling Gary how Bill has an unhealthy obsession with KEEP ON THE BORDERLANDS to which Gary started talking about B2 minutiae while designing the goblin caves. Bill's head looked like it was going to explode. Frank mentioned something in our game about this mod. I hadn't recalled that he was an editor. Anywho, he said that as soon as he was hired, they gave this mod to him to edit. He did it and added an room. He said "the manager" or management said something like, "Frank, you only correct typos or fix sentence structure, you don't add stuff to GARY'S work or some such. Anyway, they passed it on to Gary, who OK'd it and those people/managers were shocked - but that elevated Frank's stature and then begin the friendship with Gary. I believe it was the chapel entry - (oh why oh why do I not take notes of these anecdotes and ask questions?? Cause I'm an idiot. I did think of a quick question, but we had already got back into the game and that was who was his manager or who was "the management" - wondering if it was one of those Blumes). Maybe Falconer might remember more or Gary will see this post and comment. ;D
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Post by geneweigel on Jan 19, 2008 0:13:46 GMT -5
And I had thought that you guys were close and stayed in touch. We've had falling outs in recent years but we're working on that part. He had a nervous breakdown in 2001 so I didn't talk to him for three years (because I'm an obstinate fuckhead who never forgives. What? I'm a real Italian! ) then we were fine (when his dad died in 2004) and then he hooked up with some real negative broad for some time (2005-2006?) so when that was over about a year ago we started hanging out again.
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Falconer
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Post by Falconer on Jan 19, 2008 1:11:52 GMT -5
Frank said he wrote the whole Temple of Evil Chaos section, if I understood him correctly! I can only presume the actual map was Gary’s.
Frank also stated that Gary’s main motivator for writing B2 was so he (not Mike Carr) would be the one receiving royalties for the module that was included in every Basic Set. I’m sure there’s truth to that, but it doesn’t diminish the brilliance of the product. Regards.
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Post by Scott on Jan 19, 2008 9:43:13 GMT -5
I've heard from Frank before that what he added to B2 was the chapel. Michael, in regards to the whole temple, I wonder if he was referring to the Temple of Elemental Evil, it makes more sense.
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Post by grodog on Jan 19, 2008 15:37:38 GMT -5
Hey, congrats, Grodog. Ditto!! Well done! My thanks to both of you (again, since I'm sure you'd already commented in the original announcements ).
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Post by grodog on Jan 19, 2008 15:41:38 GMT -5
Frank said he wrote the whole Temple of Evil Chaos section, if I understood him correctly! I can only presume the actual map was Gary’s. vs. I've heard from Frank before that what he added to B2 was the chapel. Michael, in regards to the whole temple, I wonder if he was referring to the Temple of Elemental Evil, it makes more sense. Is it possible that Frank wrote the chapel in the keep (there is one, isn't there). vs the Temple of Evil Chaos?? I ask because the latter's pure Gygaxian, and lines up nicely with the EEG temples in G1 and G3, as well as WG4 in terms of symbolism, etc., which would have been hard for Frank to mimic as a newbie employee, I would think. Frank also stated that Gary’s main motivator for writing B2 was so he (not Mike Carr) would be the one receiving royalties for the module that was included in every Basic Set. I’m sure there’s truth to that, but it doesn’t diminish the brilliance of the product. No surprises there. The big bucks were in the volume products, and the basic sets proved to be that, in spades....
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Falconer
Enchanter
Knight Bachelor
AD&D, Middle-earth, Star Trek TOS
Posts: 330
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Post by Falconer on Jan 19, 2008 16:25:50 GMT -5
I guess you guys are right. It must have been the Chapel. I could swear I heard him say the Temple (and it was definitely regarding B2, not ToEE), but he could easily have meant the Chapel. I know Frank is a master of Gygaxian imitation (see ToEE) but it would have definitely been a huge oversight if Gary just forgot to detail the Temple of Evil Chaos! Regards.
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ghul
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Post by ghul on Jan 19, 2008 20:00:32 GMT -5
It was indeed the B2 chapel. Trust me, I know my High Gygaxian, and the Chaos Temple was Gary's prose 100%. When Frank told a roomful of us the story at the previous LGGC, he also said that when his co-workers found out what he'd done, they were all like "Nice knowing you, dude!" But Gary just said, "looks good," and so the chapel went through. This was all part of a very touching speech that Frank delivered to our small gathering, telling about his own history at TSR -- the good times, the unfortunate times, etc. He concluded by calling Gary to the microphone. There, Frank handed Gary the (then) recently recovered original ms. for Temple of Elemental Evil, to which we all rose and gave thunderous applause.
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Post by grodog on Jan 21, 2008 2:01:02 GMT -5
Thanks for clarifying, guys!
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