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Jun 7, 2009 6:46:45 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 7, 2009 6:46:45 GMT -5
This board will be for information specific to my Greyhawk campaign.
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Jun 7, 2009 6:52:57 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 7, 2009 6:52:57 GMT -5
More than that I suppose. Consider this a forum for those who would like to discuss advancing the setting a bit. Decide on the fate of Thrommel and go with it. Was the Crook of Rao recovered, and what effect did it have. What changes will the Nyrond/Great Kingdom war have? Etc.
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GT
Wizard
Duke of Indiana, Knight Commander
Posts: 2,032
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Jun 7, 2009 11:07:13 GMT -5
Post by GT on Jun 7, 2009 11:07:13 GMT -5
Well, if Thrommel is rescued, then "Velundy" will most certainly become a reality. The question is, is Iuz strong enough to take on this union, even if the Horned Society throws in on his side? That answer, in turn, depends on whether and how T1-4 is played. If Zuggtmoy is loosed and escapes, then Iuz will have great demonicassistance at his disposal, so if the Horned Society does ally with him, the fight is on in my mind! On the other hand, if you play the EEG level and the players unleash the god, then Zuggtmoy is effectively taken from the playing board (and if Lolth hasn't been defeated, she might gain some power from the distraction with possible consequences to the Drow under the western mountains...). Also, if you play Rob's Ivid modules, the PC's might rescue the real Ivid, who might then issue a statement and call off the Great Kingdom's armies and thereby cause Nyrond and Almor to reconsider their attack. In these instances, things depend heavily on the actions of the players. ^__^
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Jun 7, 2009 11:21:33 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 7, 2009 11:21:33 GMT -5
"Velundy" would be no speedy affair. The possibility might force Iuz's hand, but based on the Dragon articles and Isle of the Ape, if yo uconsider Iggwilv his ally, then he seems prepared. Thrommel may be a moot issue, since I don't think his return could have enough of an impact based on the timeline Iuz is working on. The 'Axis' powers in this war would include Iuz, the Horned Society, the Fists, and anoth ally, that I think was Ket, but I'm not sure if I'm remembering that correctly.
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Jun 7, 2009 11:33:21 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 7, 2009 11:33:21 GMT -5
Also, The Circle of Eight and Robilar would be involved as opportunistic independents, per Gary when describing how he envisioned the War as going down. The Co8 wold engage the forces of Iuz, and Robilar would see action against the Horned Society.
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GT
Wizard
Duke of Indiana, Knight Commander
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Jun 7, 2009 22:26:04 GMT -5
Post by GT on Jun 7, 2009 22:26:04 GMT -5
Yeah... Gary's take on that strikes me as more "Chaotic opportunistic Neutral" than Neutral as far as the Circle goes; and as for Robilar, he and Otto are capable foes, but to match forces with those of the Thirteen Heirarchs??? Seems rather suicidal to me... Besides, the Circle should view Iuz as a counter to the overtly good forces of Furyondy and Veluna (to name two). Now if one or more EEG's were loose, then I could see them come running as said beings possess, and I quote Gary here, "creative powers". That could spell trouble if the EEG(s) decided to remake the Flanaess into their own vision! ^__^
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GT
Wizard
Duke of Indiana, Knight Commander
Posts: 2,032
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Jun 7, 2009 22:28:38 GMT -5
Post by GT on Jun 7, 2009 22:28:38 GMT -5
Oh, yeah... I had a question too! How far are you thinking of advancing the timeline? I reset my campaign when I got back into it to 578, but I s'pose I'll have to start advancing it now!
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Jun 8, 2009 6:16:07 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 8, 2009 6:16:07 GMT -5
Yeah... Gary's take on that strikes me as more "Chaotic opportunistic Neutral" than Neutral as far as the Circle goes; and as for Robilar, he and Otto are capable foes, but to match forces with those of the Thirteen Heirarchs??? Seems rather suicidal to me... Besides, the Circle should view Iuz as a counter to the overtly good forces of Furyondy and Veluna (to name two). Now if one or more EEG's were loose, then I could see them come running as said beings possess, and I quote Gary here, "creative powers". That could spell trouble if the EEG(s) decided to remake the Flanaess into their own vision! ^__^ Mordenkainen would kill evil clerics whenever he came across them, so battling Iuz’s forces, which were likely evil cleric heavy, wouldn’t be too out of character for the Co8. Also, the Eight probably wouldn’t be thrilled about the prospect of having an expanded Land of Iuz as a neighbor. Since they would likely be in the midst of a multi-front war, I don’t see it as Robilar vs. the 13 Hierarchs. I see this more as Robilar taking advantage of the situation to establish a new freehold for himself in the area of the Bandit Kingdoms. Perhaps seizing a former bandit chief’s stronghold from the Horned Society after they had taken it from the bandit in their invasion.
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Jun 8, 2009 6:24:47 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 8, 2009 6:24:47 GMT -5
Oh, yeah... I had a question too! How far are you thinking of advancing the timeline? I reset my campaign when I got back into it to 578, but I s'pose I'll have to start advancing it now! Far enough to have resolved some of those big issues that had been pending for so long, Taking some of the events EGG initiated to their conclusion, which might change the map enough to make it easier to write non-IP infringing material.
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GT
Wizard
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Jun 8, 2009 7:03:49 GMT -5
Post by GT on Jun 8, 2009 7:03:49 GMT -5
Would the "forces of good" that razed Robilar's original stronghold and drove him away take notice and move to quell any new attempts, or would they let bygones be bygones?
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Jun 8, 2009 7:14:15 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 8, 2009 7:14:15 GMT -5
Robilar probably returned undercover, and he might be well established before the forces of good realized he was back. It would be a lot harder to march an army of good through the Bandit Kingdoms/Horned Society. Also, consider Robilar has powerful friends besides Otto. Mordenkainen didn’t intervene when the original sacking occurred, but there’s no guarantee he wouldn’t the next time.
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GT
Wizard
Duke of Indiana, Knight Commander
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Jun 8, 2009 9:24:12 GMT -5
Post by GT on Jun 8, 2009 9:24:12 GMT -5
OK, would Iggwilv survive the battles, and does she retain Tsojcanth's stronghold as a base, or have players sacked it? Rao's crook is a powerful token to Good if retrieved, but Rao seems to be somewhat distant (although Gary said that he's the most powerful of Good deities). And how would the forces of Good react to Mordenkainen's alliance with Robilar? And what of Tenser, who appears to have more than a "shade" of Good alignment in him? And does Ivid avert a major war in the East? Just wondering, as all of these things would need to be considered... I'm actually thinking of a "time jump" or "parallel Oerth" adventure where all of these things come to pass and my players are thrust there via some sort of portal.
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Jun 8, 2009 9:45:13 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 8, 2009 9:45:13 GMT -5
Iggwilv, being a god, would most likely survive the battle, but she might be banned from the Prime for a time. I can’t think of anything in the published adventure that would give her reason to move back into the Caverns. I don’t think Mordenkainen would come into play, since I don’t think Robilar would be assessable in the location noted. And what could they do anyways? Tenser might have more to fear than Robilar, since I’m sure Robilar might be looking for some payback. An interesting wrinkle is that Robilar is on good terms with Zuggtmoy. If Zuggtmoy became aware of Robilar, she may try to recruit him, and he might be willing to listen if getting back at Tenser was possible.
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Jun 8, 2009 10:03:20 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 8, 2009 10:03:20 GMT -5
The timing of the MoZ series would be important to consider. And also, Ivid might be under Zayene’s spell, but he’s just as evil and ambitious on his own. It seems like all sides involved, except for maybe Almor, have been gearing up for a war.
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Jun 8, 2009 10:26:12 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 8, 2009 10:26:12 GMT -5
Sometimes Greyhawk makes me feel like Michael Corleone in the Godfather 3, "Everytime I think I'm out, they pull me back in". I keep thinking, be a fan of the Greyhawk that is, but move on. Do your own thing. But it’s hard to just give up on those mysteries I’ve been pondering for years. You could publish a thinly disguised Greyhawk, but is it worth it?
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GT
Wizard
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Jun 8, 2009 10:28:31 GMT -5
Post by GT on Jun 8, 2009 10:28:31 GMT -5
Restored Ivid, on his own and uncontrolled by Zayene/Xaene, seems less Chaotic in his actions--perhaps even Lawful, and therefore acting with more foresight. As to Tenser, I get the impression that even with only his own resources he was a force to be reckoned with (Rogue's Gallery, Isle of the Ape and Gord books). Also; what of Basiliv? In the original Gazeteer, he was listed at 18th level, by the Box Set Gary told me he was 20th level... but by the Gord novels he was a "demiurge" and I would venture between 25th and 30th level! In the Gord novels he assists the Circle (in the interest of Balance), but originally he was a solo player--what are his motives in the ensuing years (in particular, versus those of the Circle or "Velundy"?). Gary hinted at various times that that he had powers equal to an EEG (creative)...
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GT
Wizard
Duke of Indiana, Knight Commander
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Jun 8, 2009 10:35:54 GMT -5
Post by GT on Jun 8, 2009 10:35:54 GMT -5
Heh! Nobody but Gary could give us his "true" vision! But, some like Frank M., Ernie "the Man", Jeff T., and a few of us might be able to pool our knowledge and come up with a reasonable facsimile, at least! I might add that in no other genre (Star Wars, Star Trek, Lord Of The Rings, whatever... ) would I spend so much time pondering timelines, consequences, etc. Gary (and those who worked with him--Dave, Rob, Frank, Jeff, etc.) was truly a wondrous storyteller! ;D
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Jun 8, 2009 10:41:36 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 8, 2009 10:41:36 GMT -5
Yeah, the legitimacy is another issue. I know it would just be one take on things, but with the right people involved it might carry some weight.
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Jun 8, 2009 11:07:44 GMT -5
Post by Scott on Jun 8, 2009 11:07:44 GMT -5
Sure Tenser is a force to be reckoned with, but so is Robilar, and Otto is an arch-mage. And if you consider Mordenkainen, the balance certainly tips. Until Robilar became a pending threat, I think it would be more a case of keeping a watchful eye on him. What else could they do?
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GT
Wizard
Duke of Indiana, Knight Commander
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Jun 8, 2009 11:54:11 GMT -5
Post by GT on Jun 8, 2009 11:54:11 GMT -5
Well, Otto is gonna be of lesser level than Tenser for sure, and I think Mordenkainen would rather "stay out of it" than necessarily side with Robilar. They were comrades when Robilar was of neutral bent, but now I think that the best one could expect is "temporary respect for past times together"--not actual alliance... Robilar does not directly push forward the aggenda of Balance. ^__^
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