Best Series!

[GT]

This is undoubtedly THE classic AD&D epic adventure! Humanoids, giants, subterranean monstrosities, drow, demons, undead, daemons, and--yes--a Demoness Lord! All woven together in one great story! Some of my colleagues, including Merric B., have brought up the fact that Gary did not finish the series and that it therefore seems to shift gears a bit much. I do not concur. Gary's original plan was to have an epic face-off involving the Elder Elemental God, but he decided that would be too much like his version of the conclusion of Temple of Elemental Evil (sadly, lacking in the rushed-out released version... ) However, if the characters have defeated the Fire Giants and Eclavdra they have already effectively cut the EEG out of this particular picture--leaving only Lolth to be brought to heel! And what a cool concept for a level of the Abyss; a web of worlds caught up in Lolth's plans, with horrid arachnid critters wandering about! And Lolth's great artifact? Not a wand, staff, venom fountain, or cauldron, but a gigantic fortress-vessel! I actually feel sorry for newer players who don't remember what it was like to have to wait for weeks at a time for new modules to be released (and quality modules at that!) I remember that Q1 and S3 both came out around Christmas of 1980, and what a Christmas it was! A sorry day it was when we finally figured out that Gary, and then Rob and Frank, had left the fold and no more modules of that type would be forthcoming (...for awhile). Anyhow, here's my vote for the GDQ series as an example of the best ever! The only adventure that could potentially be better is the great Castle Greyhawk itself; but we shall see... ^__^

[dcas]

D3 ends with the characters setting sail on the Sunless Sea. But then Q1 begins with the characters at the Fane of Lolth, no? I would call that "switching gears."

I was just reading C.S. Lewis' The Silver Chair this week and it is a great model for a wilderness/Underdark campaign. In fact I'm wondering if Gary mined it for some ideas when he was writing the G/D series.

[GT]

DCS-- on page 20 of the original module, there is a portal to Lolth's plane. If a DM planned to use Q1, this would be an entry. OTHERWISE, you could use the galleys for an alternative ending... Not switching gears; just two choices.

[foster1941]

I give this series props for its epic scope, and for being first, and there are some individual parts/set-pieces that I really love (the entire Steading of the Hill Giant Chief, the EEG shrine in the Hall of the Fire Giant King, the city of Erelhei Cinlu) but as a whole the series doesn't hang together that well for me. I find the 'official' linkages between G1, G2, and G3 too contrived (realizing that with only 8 pp to work with space was at a premium, but still...), I'm not too crazy about the actual 'module content' of D1 and D2 (I love the setting and the atmosphere and the overall 'idea,' but the big cavern in D1 and the shrine in D2 strike me (admittedly, I haven't read or played either of these in many years, so I might be forgetting or misremembering something) as little more than big slugfests that don't provide any forward momentum to the overall plot except "we need to go through here to keep following the map"), and I'm not a fan of Q1 at all -- to me it loses the fantasy/medieval feeling, and has way too much cheesy stuff like the flustered Type V Demon secretary. While I'd definitely put G1, G2, G3, and D3 all near the top of my list of favorite modules, I like the individual parts better than the series as a whole.

[GT]

Well, the Giant-series is contrived to be linear, but from a gaming standpoint it wouln't be quite the same to find out about the conspiracy at the Fire Giant's Hall first--unless your PC's were already that high of level. As to D1 and D2, they are there as part of a underground tour-de-force;
to demonstrate underground cultures and --yes-- give the party some "warm-up" battles. However, the DM version of the map provides many alternative routes if the DM feels these encounters are unnecessary. I liked 'em though--these were the first extended subterranean adventures my group got to run through, and it made them think--and worry about what was coming next. I doctored the linking tunnels with oozes, piercers, rust monsters and even a beholder. By the time they reached Erelhei-Cinlu, they were seasoned adventurers! The Type V demoness matron in Q1? Perhaps a bit comedic, but we know demon lords have their assistants, no matter how unorganized some are. Much of the "humorous" aspect of Q1 was also a demonstration of the utter chaos that abounds--and not very humorous when it turns on you...

[Scott]

I love the entire GD series. I like Q1, but I will always be disappointed that I did not get to see EGG's version of the conclusion, especially since he states that the end was too similar to the ToEE, and I never really got to see his complete vision of that either. The conclusion of the GD series could see the release of the EEG. Gary's ToEE could see the release of the ToEE. We never got to see the release of the EEG.
Scott

[GT]

I, too, as well known across many boards am an Elder Elemental God fan! I consider said entity far "darker" than either the Lolth or Zuggtmoy substitutes. I'd rather have seen the EEG in the Temple though, as a final battle with the interloper Zuggtmoy! I believe that the EEG might win that one... ^__^

[Falconer]

I'm currently running GDQ. That is, I was until the party was horribly defeated in G2. Now they're taking a hiatus and chose to check out WG4, which is cool.

Anyway, so far the mood and play of the giants modules was really awesome, and I can't wait to resume it.

I, too, read The Silver Chair recently and was struck by the similarity of the "Gentle Giants" to G1, and of the whole consequent subterranean descent to the D modules. Gygax's deep gnomes are clearly based on Lewis's gnomes, I think.

Adding a few touches from this novel might be cool. The Ruined City of the giants with its giant "UNDER ME" writing and its history always seemed really awesome to me, as did the descent itself when they passed the sleeping super-giant Father Time and his dragons. Regards.

[dcas]

Falconer said:

Adding a few touches from this novel might be cool. The Ruined City of the giants with its giant "UNDER ME" writing and its history always seemed really awesome to me, as did the descent itself when they passed the sleeping super-giant Father Time and his dragons. Regards.

Not to mention the deep subterranean city of Bism with its living gems ("ever eat a ruby or drink a cup of diamond juice?").

[GT]

So was the evil serpent queen Eclavdra or Lolth, DCS? ^__^

[dcas]

gt said:

So was the evil serpent queen Eclavdra or Lolth, DCS? ^__^

I would have to say Eclavdra since she was so easily slain. In fact that's one thing that bothered me -- she changes into a serpent and then is immediately killed by Rillian.