|
Post by GRWelsh on Jan 14, 2020 15:44:56 GMT -5
Just to do something different, I had the idea to run adventure modules published in DRAGON magazine, and stitch them together into an original campaign world. So, the village of Awad and Jawarl Avignon from "Citadel by the Sea" would be along a coast, and further along the coast or across the sea would be "Barnacus: City of Peril," and up in the hills would be the village of Byr from "Chagmat" and the town of Narrion from "Pit of the Oracle" and so on... Just sort of create it as we go from one adventure to another, and see what we come up with for a campaign world. I could possibly even lay the groundwork for some mid and higher level modules by placing Nefaron, Termlane Forest, Beoll-Dur, Fell Pass, etc. on a continent map. I suppose some adventures from DUNGEON magazine could be included as well. Has anyone ever done this?
P. S. This wouldn't include running Gene's BROKEN CASTLE for my players, which I'd also like to do, but I'd rather keep that separate from this random module idea.
|
|
|
Post by geneweigel on Jan 14, 2020 18:21:49 GMT -5
In the late 80's, I was plopping homemade and/or magazine adventures plus non-GH modules as well on a reduced Greyhawk map, copied from eye, which I eventually lost (Stolen? Knowledge of where they were is lost as I don't recall). Only Dungeon magazine locales that I penciled on the real GH map are remnants from later in that time. Losing stuff like that really made me go through things over and over where I would be at my wit's end. The more I think about lost material makes me wonder if its "stuck" in something that I've glossed over. Of note during that time the mentality was to just play as much as possible just to keep it flowing though. Parties would break up at the end of the session. Routine consistent parties were non-existent and characters were bringing their own help from party to party.
|
|
|
Post by GRWelsh on Jan 14, 2020 18:41:32 GMT -5
Of note during that time the mentality was to just play as much as possible just to keep it flowing though. That was the idea here as well -- just play, keep things moving, don't overthink it. I tend to get bogged down in lore, minutiae, the aesthetics, and most players don't care about all that. They want to kill monsters, get magic items, and laugh it up. So, this isn't a great idea, just a fun idea to loosen up and start DMing again. It could be an interesting exercise in world-building from the pragmatic angle.
|
|
|
Post by geneweigel on Jan 14, 2020 19:53:31 GMT -5
I need to have a regular energized game as well but I'm considering moving right now (Probably above Westchester) so I don't want any new players right now. Maybe when the dust settles.
|
|
|
Post by GRWelsh on Jan 16, 2020 12:56:16 GMT -5
After giving it more thought, and re-reading several of these adventures, most of them are a natural fit for the World of Greyhawk. So, there really isn't any need to build a new setting from scratch -- even though I still like that idea as a sort of creative exercise. The most efficient route is to make use of existing published adventures and settings. Greyhawk's world was built to accommodate such a hodge-podge. Where have you guys placed these modules? Some seem like no-brainers: "Chapel of Silence" and "Citadel by the Sea" on the Wild Coast, "Barnacus" and "Seapoint" used as Wild Coast cities, "The Wandering Trees" in the Gnarley or Suss Forest, "Forest of Doom" in the Suss Forest, "Chagmat" in the Kron Hills, and "Sword of Justice" goes almost anywhere in the Kron Hills or Wild Coast. "Temple of Poseidon" could be simply renamed "Temple of Procan." Other gods referenced in the modules could be tied to Greyhawk, and so too with realms, NPC's, etc.
|
|
|
Post by geneweigel on Jan 16, 2020 14:32:04 GMT -5
Placement-wise was usually mid-map in general surrounding Greyhawk so proximate of where you mentioned for me.
|
|
|
Post by Scott on Jan 24, 2020 6:42:02 GMT -5
I’d like to give it a try. Why don’t you try running something in Roll20? I haven’t been a player in a regular campaign in forever.
|
|
|
Post by GRWelsh on Jan 24, 2020 18:11:41 GMT -5
Yes, that's a good idea. I'll log onto Roll20 and refamiliarize with the tools. I was thinking in terms of live games, but there's no reason I can't run a Roll20 version. I think the last time I was on I got too bogged down with all the bells and whistles, but really all I need is a conference call with a means of visually displaying simple diagrams.
It looks like we last used Roll20 when you ran that game for Mark and me back on 1/5/2018. That was fun, and I'm not sure what we never continued it...
|
|
|
Post by Scott on Jan 24, 2020 20:09:47 GMT -5
Yeah, I enjoyed it. But I think I got bogged down with all the possibilities too. I started trying to work on fancier maps, and making better tokens, and I j use didn't have the time. Next time I run something I'm going to keep it simple.
|
|
|
Post by grodog on Feb 2, 2020 21:08:08 GMT -5
After giving it more thought, and re-reading several of these adventures, most of them are a natural fit for the World of Greyhawk. So, there really isn't any need to build a new setting from scratch -- even though I still like that idea as a sort of creative exercise. The most efficient route is to make use of existing published adventures and settings. Greyhawk's world was built to accommodate such a hodge-podge. Where have you guys placed these modules? Some seem like no-brainers: "Chapel of Silence" and "Citadel by the Sea" on the Wild Coast, "Barnacus" and "Seapoint" used as Wild Coast cities, "The Wandering Trees" in the Gnarley or Suss Forest, "Forest of Doom" in the Suss Forest, "Chagmat" in the Kron Hills, and "Sword of Justice" goes almost anywhere in the Kron Hills or Wild Coast. "Temple of Poseidon" could be simply renamed "Temple of Procan." Other gods referenced in the modules could be tied to Greyhawk, and so too with realms, NPC's, etc. You've definitely snagged a lot of the cooler adventures, Gary, and your placements sound good to me. I've got a list of favorites that includes Dungeon and Dragon modules, but like I said you've already tagged the best, so I don't really have a lot to add Allan.
|
|
|
Post by GRWelsh on Apr 29, 2021 9:25:37 GMT -5
Here is where I will post my notes on adventures published in DRAGON Magazine [more updates to come]:
THE HALL OF MYSTERY (#21, December 1978, Don Turnbull, OD&D, no levels given but I would say 6th+): This is like a time capsule from the 1970's era of D&D when an adventure could be a one page map with a one page key, and the goal was simply to explore the dungeon. It has traps, teleport points and secret panels, which were common features of old style dungeons. Also of note is that the cartography appears to be done by DCS III, reminiscent of maps from the G series published the same year. People nowadays tend to make fun of these sorts of "kill the monster and take its treasure" adventures, but there is something to be said for brevity and utility. If a DM can look at a map and a key and within 10 minutes be running a game there is something to be said for that. It is a lesson worth learning and re-learning once it has been forgotten. THE FELL PASS (#32, November 1979, Karl Merris, AD&D, no levels given but I would say 5th+): This adventure is fairly basic but has some outside of the box encounters beyond what is covered by the rules. There is a creative curse, some magical situations that are unique. The overall set up is simple with monsters infesting a mountain pass, although based on the maps it looks more like caves that go through the mountains. It is of historical interest as the first adventure published in THE DRAGON after the complete AD&D rules were published (MM, PH, and DMG).
DOOMKEEP (#34, February 1980, Brian Blume, AD&D, for three pregenerated characters from levels 4-10): Another time capsule since this is from the height of tournament play... This module was designed for the "Second Official AD&D Masters Tournament." It is a reminder that AD&D was developed at least in part for uniformity in tournament play. It was a time when players and teams were ranked according to how well they performed under pressure. This competitive aspect of play didn't catch on for the long run, but for a brief period AD&D did have winners and losers. Brian Blume (aka "Medium Rary" aka "Rary the Traitor") gets a lot of criticism for business dealings at TSR, but it is worth remembering that he was a gamer before all of that happened. The tournament was designed by Brian Blume, who also acted as head referee. The dungeon was constructed of rooms or parts of rooms submitted by those invited to play in the tournament. Also of interest is that there is a region map provided at the end implying this could be developed into a campaign setting.
THE PIT OF THE ORACLE (#37, May 1980, Stephen Sullivan, AD&D, no levels given but I'd say 6th+): An early example of a sandbox, this adventure has a map of the town of Narrion and surrounding lands as well as a two level dungeon. The maps are very rudimentary, especially the region map, and look like something a kid would have drawn in middle school (a town shaped like a perfect rectangle, for example). But I'm not making fun of it, I love this sort of thing, and it is a reminder of how creative most DMs were when inventing their own adventures and setting. There is enough here to fire the imagination and develop a campaign out of. The challenge level is pretty high, as there are some tough monsters in here.
THE MANSION OF MAD PROFESSOR LUDLOW (#42, October 1980, James M. Ward, AD&D): An oddity, this scenario uses AD&D rules but is set in the modern day with the players assuming the roles of young campers exploring a mansion. In a way, it reminds me of a CALL OF CTHULHU scenario with normal people exploring a creepy place. I've never played it, but always wondered if it was worth converting for a more traditional AD&D party.
THE TEMPLE OF POSEIDON (#46, February 1981, Paul Reiche III, AD&D, for 7-10 characters with a combined total of at least 70 levels): The author notes that he drew upon two of his favorite authors, H. P. Lovecraft and Clark Ashton Smith, for a mood. That alone should make me reconsider using this adventure. The name of the Dark King, Ythog-Nthlei, is obviously a mash-up of Yog Sothoth and the underwater city of the Deep Ones, Y’ha-nthlei, from "The Shadow Over Innsmouth." I never noticed that before.
THE CHAPEL OF SILENCE (#50, June 1981, Mollie Plants, Basic D&D, for a balanced party of six 2nd-3rd level characters): This adventure reads very well, and it hits that nostalgia for me as it is written for the Basic D&D rules edited by J. Eric Holmes, the first D&D I ever played. I believe it is the only adventure in THE DRAGON that incudes the Dex score for each monster because in that version of Basic D&D Dex determined initiative. But aside from nostalgia, this is a well written adventure worth converting to AD&D or another system because it looks fun, challenging and cinematic. The only thing I don't like is how the maps are based on hexagons and recycled for several levels. If I run this, I'm going to draw out my own detailed maps.
THE GARDEN OF NEFARON (#53, September 1981, Howard de Wied, AD&D, for 6-8 characters of 7-10th level): There is much I like about this adventure: the maps, the epic background, the challenge level, and the new monster and magic items. It is one of the few AD&D adventures that makes full use of psionics as they appear in the PH and DMG rules. Since I never use psionics, that's a negative for me. The dungeon appears to be fairly linear as well, descending to the conclusion... That could play out well, but in general I dislike a lack of options or choices for players. I did notice one rules flaw: the original body of Malakon was a half-elf 7th/17th level fighter/magic-user. He could have been a dual-classed human with those levels, but not a multi-classed half-elf. In spite of these things, I think this adventure is worth running with some prep work.
CAVERN QUEST (#54, October 1981, Bill Fawcett, AD&D, for one player using a pregenerated character): Another oddity from the days of tournament play, this one also taps into the "choose your own adventure" craze of the early 80's, although this isn't strictly solo and does require a referee. It might be best described as "AD&D: the multiple choice test" to assess a player's basic decision making skills. It looks like it is intended to be played with a DM and a succession of different players to find out who can get the highest score. One of these days I should play it just to find out what my score is!
THE CREATURE OF RHYL (#55, November 1981, Kevin Knuth, Basic D&D for as few as 2-3 characters or as many as half a dozen, some characters can be 1st level but a strong party will have a 3rd level spell caster or pair of fighters at least 2nd level each): It is unclear which version of Basic D&D this adventure was written for, as it lacks the Dex score for monsters that the Holmes edition always included, yet also it includes some features from Holmes rules including similarities to the Holmes sample dungeon. My guess is that it was originally written for the Holmes rules but edited to be compatible with the Moldvay Basic rules which were published earlier that year in 1981. I really like the heroic quest theme, the map, and many of the room descriptions, but there are too many empty rooms and too many magic items just laying around waiting to be picked up on the first dungeon level. Occasionally finding magic items like that is okay, but most of the time players should have to earn their treasure through fighting or overcoming danger. I would add more monsters and/or traps to the 1st dungeon level and make this a module for 2nd-3rd level characters considering the monster they have to fight at the end.
THE WANDERING TREES (#57, January 1982, Michael Malone, AD&D for a party of 6th-9th level characters). I like the premise of a forest with shifting pathways because of trees moving around, and characters getting lost while searching for the ruins of a reclusive sect of druids, but the rules for the paths have always looked a bit complicated. Also, it seems like the players need a stronger motivation to find the ruins than simply "treasure might be there" and they may become frustrated by constantly getting lost and give up. I know it is intended to be frustrating to the players, but I think a stronger motivation would lead to a better payoff at the end, and perhaps finding an entity within can be tied to something important to the campaign. I like the maps, illustrations and many of the encounters, and I like that a region around the ruins is detailed, and this could easily be placed within a Darlene hex in some forest of the World of Greyhawk... Hmmm... I may have just thought of a good idea for it.
QUEST FOR THE MIDAS ORB (#61, May 1982, Jennie Good, AD&D, no levels given but I'd say 4th-7th): Nice maps, fun illustrations by Jim Holloway, epic background given, and tough challenges from NPCs. I need to read this one in more detail to give a better review.
CHAGMAT (#63, July 1982, Larry DiTillio, AD&D for 6-8 characters of levels 1-4): This is a favorite of mine and was in the first issue of DRAGON Magazine that I ever owned. It's one of those dungeons that really captures the feeling of an alien environment.
THE ASSASSINS' RUN (#64, August 1982, Ed Greenwood, AD&D)
FEDIFENSOR (#67, November 1982, AD&D)
FOREST OF DOOM (#73, May 1983, Scott Butler, AD&D): I have always liked 'dungeon' designs that are non-standard in this case being inside a giant tree in a dark forest, which has a fairy tale vibe. It's a good early use of Drow in a module, really just a variation on how they were used in the G series... Instead of being behind giant attacks, in this module they're behind humanoid attacks coming out of a forest. On this World of Greyhawk this would fit in well in the Dim Forest. [Side trivia: This issue of Dragon Magazine is when they switched fonts from Century Schoolbook to Baskerville.]
CAN SEAPOINT BE SAVED? (#75, July 1983, AD&D)
CITADEL BY THE SEA (#78, October 1983, AD&D)
THE RUINS OF ANDRIL (#81, January 1984, AD&D)
THE DANCING HUT (#83, March 1984, AD&D)
THE TWOFOLD TALISMAN, PART 1: THE HEART OF LIGHT (#84, April 1984, AD&D)
THE TWOFOLD TALISMAN, PART 2: THE EBON STONE (#85, May 1984, AD&D)
AESIRHAMMAR (#90, October 1984, AD&D)
THE SWORD OF JUSTICE (#92, December 1984, AD&D)
THE GYPSY TRAIN (#93, January 1985)
INTO THE FORGOTTEN REALMS (#95, March 1985)
NOGARD (#96, April 1985)
THE CITY BEYOND THE GATE (#100, August 1985)
VALLEY OF THE EARTH MOTHER (#102, October 1985)
BETRAYED! (#105, January 1986)
THE HOUSE IN THE FROZEN LANDS (#110, June 1986)
DEATH OF AN ARCH-MAGE (#111, July 1986)
|
|
|
Post by grodog on Apr 29, 2021 20:03:47 GMT -5
FWIW, these are my favorites among those you listed: Here is where I will post my notes on adventures published in DRAGON Magazine [more updates to come]: THE GARDEN OF NEFARON (#53, September 1981) THE ASSASSINS' RUN (#64, August 1982) FEDIFENSOR (#67, November 1982) Other favorites: - Can Seapoint Be Saved? Bob Waldbauer 075 (45) - Citadel By the Sea Sid Fisher 078 (41) D&D1 - Barnacus: City In Peril Francois Nantel 080 (35) D&D1 - Ruins of Andril, The Ian Melluish 081 (47) D&D1 - Dancing Hut, The Roger E. Moore 083 (31) D&D1 Allan.
|
|
|
Post by GRWelsh on May 10, 2021 9:35:29 GMT -5
Allan -- Thanks for the call outs. I like a lot the same ones you do. I put together a binder of some of my favorite low level adventures from DRAGON Magazine. There is enough in here to DM games for at least a year. This will save me a lot of work, although I will probably change or re-key many of the adventures to suit my campaign. I view modules as sources of inspiration rather than anything I must strictly adhere to.
THE CHAPEL OF SILENCE THE CREATURE OF RHYL CHAGMAT CITADEL BY THE SEA THE SWORD OF JUSTICE BARNACUS: CITY IN PERIL
That should be enough to get everyone through levels 1-4 or so, assuming there could be deaths and re-starts as well. Others I'm considering are FALCON'S PEAK from DUNGEON Magazine and N1: AGAINST THE CULT OF THE REPTILE GOD, an old module set in the World of Greyhawk that I've never DMed or played.
One of the reasons I haven't wanted to DM as much in the past 15 or so years is that my job requires so much mental energy that by the time I get to the weekend I feel energy drained. But I've started to enjoy DMing again by accepting that not everything has to be original or perfect. Ideally, I'd like everything I DM to be original: custom miniatures terrain, hand drawn illustrations and maps, my own monsters and magic items -- the whole works.
|
|
|
Post by GRWelsh on May 11, 2021 11:54:58 GMT -5
Scott -- Which adventures in DRAGON Magazine have you played or DMed?
|
|
|
Post by grodog on May 14, 2021 12:48:21 GMT -5
Allan -- Thanks for the call outs. I like a lot the same ones you do. I put together a binder of some of my favorite low level adventures from DRAGON Magazine. There is enough in here to DM games for at least a year. This will save me a lot of work, although I will probably change or re-key many of the adventures to suit my campaign. I view modules as sources of inspiration rather than anything I must strictly adhere to. I think that makes perfect sense, particularly in light of your comments below. In my mind, modules are not only intended to be “modular” but they must support being fold-spindle-mutilated by the group’s play requirements, so even running the same adventures in different campaigns can result in wildly different backgrounds/set-ups, changes/customizations/rewrites, and play outcomes. Letting go of perfection is a big help! If you are, however, spending a lot of time customizing the module before play, it may actually be simpler/easier from a level-of-effort POV to create something from scratch—that probably depends as much on your DM creative process as anything else, but it’s probably worth considering Allan.
|
|
|
Post by grodog on May 14, 2021 12:52:40 GMT -5
THE GARDEN OF NEFARON (#53, September 1981, Howard de Wied, AD&D, for 6-8 characters of 7-10th level): There is much I like about this adventure: the maps, the epic background, the challenge level, and the new monster and magic items. It is one of the few AD&D adventures that makes full use of psionics as they appear in the PH and DMG rules. Since I never use psionics, that's a negative for me. The dungeon appears to be fairly linear as well, descending to the conclusion... That could play out well, but in general I dislike a lack of options or choices for players. I did notice one rules flaw: the original body of Malakon was a half-elf 7th/17th level fighter/magic-user. He could have been a dual-classed human with those levels, but not a multi-classed half-elf. In spite of these things, I think this adventure is worth running with some prep work. I ran this at least once BITD, and lifted Nefaron as an island name for my homebrew world, Mendenein. I remember liking it a lot, but I’ll have to reread it again with your criticisms in mind to see if it still holds up Allan.
|
|
|
Post by GRWelsh on May 14, 2021 13:36:52 GMT -5
Yes, Allan, that's good advice. If I find myself re-writing more than 20-30% of a module I might as well rewrite it from scratch! In some cases I may completely re-key existing maps. Overall, I'm looking for modules in which I only want to change about 5-10%. For example, with "The Sword of Justice" I think it is perfectly playable, as is, so I'm only making a few changes. One is cosmetic. The set up with the wanted poster, the Judge's Inn, Judge Clayton Miles and the reference to a posse all seem more like a Wild West genre more than a medieval fantasy genre. So, I'm changing the Judge's Inn to Farstead Keep and the judge to a castellan with a more fantasy-sounding name like Calyton. One of my players rolled up a paladin, so he may be sent to help the castellan with an urgent matter and I can work in liege/vassal obligation for a more medieval feel. Something else that works just fine is that when the players show up the mystery is already solved and they are sent to tell Falrik he is pardoned for the murder he was accused of and he just needs to turn over the magic sword, Annacon. But this seems to miss an opportunity to allow the players to assume Falrik is guilty just like everyone else, or to investigate it ("... if he was innocent, why had he run away when the sword could have proven this beyond a shadow of a doubt?" "Everyone knows elves are fascinated with magic... Perhaps this whole thing was a clever plot by the elf to get his hands on the magic sword!" "But if the sword can detect lies, why did it glow before a question was even asked, and without the elf even speaking?"). Allowing them to wonder what is going on adds a mystery, and also perhaps more satisfaction at the end if they finally figure it all out and bring the adventure to resolution.
I'm starting the new campaign tomorrow and it is the first time in over a year that we've played in person together, so I'm expecting lots of joking, laughing, pre-game BS, etc. Even though I told everyone to roll up and equip two characters, I know we'll end up spending time on character generation. So, I'm anticipating only a couple hours of actual playing and I'm going to have have a small 5-room dungeon to explore on the way to Farstead.
It's strange that up until even a few days ago I assumed I was going to start the campaign in the Kron Hills or the Wild Coast as usual, but it turns out I'm starting them out in Hochoch south of the Dim Forest...
|
|
|
Post by GRWelsh on Jul 21, 2021 15:49:41 GMT -5
So far, I've run "The Sword of Justice" which took us through our first four sessions including the bandit hideout which was my original material added on. This module had a fair amount of quirkiness which is the sort of thing I love to expand on. I had the players play out the background mystery rather than just give it to them as exposition, and when they returned with the lie-detecting magic sword, Annacon, I had the corrupt captain of the guard who was the murderer kidnap the peasant girl he was in love with and flee to the bandit hideout where one of his relatives was the bandit leader. The party brought them to justice and rescued the peasant girl. The mansion of Kanos also had some cool mystery items, like the floating dagger and black box in the trophy room, and the triple-locked junk room in the cellar... I used the chart of low magic items from DRAGON #73 to provide some items for that room. I like the background of a dwarf-elf war fought three hundred years ago in this region, and I'm going to keep that for my campaign.
Next, I'm considering adapting "Citadel by the Sea" even though this campaign is set in a land-locked region, as I can alter it to be set along a river ("Citadel by the Stream" set on the Realstream). As I review this module, I am wondering why everybody likes it so much since it is pretty much just orcs, ogrillons, kobold slaves, giant rats, a wererat, large spiders, skeletons, pit, ballista trap. stonework trap and glyph trap. I think it is just one of those modules that plays out perfectly and feels like traditional D&D... Traps, monsters and treasure... Big fight at the end, with a unique magic item. The intrigue part at the beginning seems a bit contrived and the background information on the half-orc's family is good but I can't imagine how it would come in play since the players are just going to attack the orcs on sight. Alkarg the "Elf Destroyer" magic spear is quite different and actually could tie into my background of the dwarf-elf war. Perhaps in my campaign, the dwarves made this spear and now the orcs are trying to recover it to use against elves?
|
|
|
Post by geneweigel on Jul 21, 2021 17:08:39 GMT -5
That, elf-dwarf war, sounds familiar but I'm not sure if I ran that.
|
|
|
Post by Scott on Jul 21, 2021 21:35:57 GMT -5
I’d like to read Citadel by the Sea again it’s been decades. I have vague recollections of it being good. Maybe it’s a nostalgia thing.
|
|